Can you print out the attachment for me? -----Original Message----- From: Daniel Chapman [mailto:dchapman@HNTB.com] Sent: Saturday, January 23, 2010 1:29 PM To: Nancy Cline Cc: Jerry Holder; Steve Hague; James Frye Subject: RE: Bridge Hi Nancy: Following is something to think about until we talk again Monday morning. I also copied Jerry, Steve and James in the event they are checking their e-mail over the weekend and might have other thoughts or input to provide. 1. Plan details have been modified to address several of the comments made during our cursory review. They still do not provide plan information to the level of detail typical for the bridge engineering industry. Consequently, we cannot provide any assurance or recommendation to the Town as to the potential for limited RFI's and change orders during construction. Our opinion is that there may be many. 2. While we are capable of performing an independent design review, risk management concerns will not allow us share in the design liability with an professional firm not experienced in bridge design and plans preparation. This why our participation to date has been limited to a cursory plans review. 3. Based on the previous bids, we believe those received from experienced bridge contractors are reflective of the minimum actual construction cost of the current proposed design. We would have recommended the Town reject the low bidder that had limited bridge construction experience and certainly not of this type. 4. If the Town must adhere to a $4.5 million budget, including design and construction engineering and inspection, a less costly bridge type must be utilized - most likely a three span prestressed concrete beam bridge. This does not automatically make it a TxDOT standard bridge. If the Town were to use a TxDOT standard bridge type, say a prestressed concrete I-beam, the combined construction cost for these two bridges would be approximately $1.5 million. Prestressed concrete box beam bridges will provide an aesthetically pleasing underside and would cost approximately $2.5 million. This would still allow for more than $1 million in additional aesthetic enhancements for the two bridges. We had a similar issue in Waco where a developer who has a grand vision for Baylor University wanted to build a suspension bridge for IH 35 over the Brazos River. The crossing did not warrant a suspension bridge. The developer then asked about a faux suspension bridge. Steve Hague and James Frye were involved in this and we recommend against a faux bridge because the cost to make a faux suspension bridge look real from the roadway, is about the same cost as the real thing. Further, with a promenade along the river, the view of the bridge from the river would have been unattractive. James Frye and his team developed the concept shown in the attached rendering (City of Waco representatives love it by the way). Notice how the light poles in the median replicates the line of a suspension cable (the night view is the best). 5. A two month schedule is possible depending on the structure type and the aesthetic enhancements. We would need an approved concept by the Town before the time starts ticking on the two months. As mentioned below, I think it would be well worth it to have James and his team come up with some draft sketches of an aesthetically enhanced prestressed concrete box beam bridge that is within the Town's project budget. 6. I'm not real familiar with bridge construction in California. I believe they frequently use cast-in-place or precast segmental post-tensioned concrete box beam bridges. I'm guessing these would likely fall outside the $4.5 budget as well. Steve might be able to provide better feedback on this issue and what typical SF construction costs might be. Best regards, Dan -----Original Message----- From: Nancy Cline [mailto:ncline@addisontx.gov] Sent: Saturday, January 23, 2010 11:13 AM To: Daniel Chapman Cc: Jerry Holder; Steve Hague Subject: Re: Bridge Dan, Thank you for the details. We need to be sure to include design fees. Would you be able to call first thing Monday to discuss your thoughts on the plans? I think the biggest decision is whether to proceed with bidding the set we have. If we decided to start over, I think the biggest obstacle is the design time. If you had to design something in two months, is it possible? I don't know what Ron would think but I like some of the bridge design looks in California because they are sleeker. I have heard him say he does not want a TxDOT bridge. Thank you, Nancy ----- Original Message ----- From: Daniel Chapman To: Nancy Cline Cc: Jerry Holder ; Steve Hague ; James Frye Sent: Fri Jan 22 18:49:21 2010 Subject: RE: Bridge Nancy: Assuming the $4.5 million budget is for Ponte Ave. and Bella Lane bridges only (i.e. does not include the pedestrian bridge), that equates to approximately $160 per SF including the retained approaches (we would likely recommend additional bridge length in lieu of the cast-in-place U-shaped retaining wall approaches currently proposed). A three span concrete box beam bridge with no aesthetic treatments would be in the range of $80 to $90 per SF. That would leave a considerable budget for aesthetic enhancements - approximately $2 million. The multiple span bridge is obviously not as open under the bridge as the current proposed design but it does put the project back into the Town's budget threshold. You might want to consider allowing us to engage our urban planners under the contract we have for cursory design review to develop an aesthetic concept for this type of bridge. We have approximately $20k left in our current budget. I'm guessing for that amount we could get some good ideas on the table for the Town's consideration. James Frye and his staff are exceptionally good at developing aesthetic enhancements for bridges. Depending on the level of aesthetic details, it would likely take four to six months to develop plans and specifications in accordance with TxDOT bridge development guidelines. We could provide a better schedule estimate once we know what the final concept is. Hope this helps. Have a great weekend and I will see you Monday morning. Dan -----Original Message----- From: Nancy Cline [mailto:ncline@addisontx.gov] Sent: Friday, January 22, 2010 3:08 PM To: Daniel Chapman; Jerry Holder Subject: Re: Bridge Dan, Lea would like to proceed with 9:30 am on Monday with you at the meeting. Some background for our meeting: we met yesterday with Lea, Carmen, Clay, Jason Mathis (attorney who helps us out along with John Hill - but John is in China) to discuss the developers request for us to amend our funding agreemnet to identify $3 million more for their share of the park. I stated that I was worried about where we would get the $2 million we believe we are under-funded on the bridges. We also are looking for a couple more million for improvements to Spring Valley. Clay spoke up and said he just really didn't think we should bid the bridges as they are designed. Lea had not heard that before. So Clay elaborated about all the concerns he has for the un-reliability for the plans and if we want to make sure it works we should pay you guys a bunch more to model it. I said that even with a model done, there are still the welds that you can't inspect fully. I feel like there has to be a certain degree of trust in the design to proceed. I don't think you guys should own the responsibility for the design. Jason, the attorney is spending a great amount of time on the fuel farm lawsuit. He thinks this sounds like a similar scenario and drilled Clay with a couple of questions such as "Clay, why did you bid these plans if you knew there were so many problems."., etc. Then we discussed that the original design for the bridges were for culverts. Lea wondered whether it would be possible to design two bridges that cost $4.5 million instead of $6.5 million. I told her Dan had data for what regular bridges cost. Dan- could you run this? Also, Lea wondered what a regular one with artistic arches would cost. I do actually hesitate to bid these plans partially because of Victor's un-willingness to cooperate and appreciate the benefit of the help we are trying to give him. I wonder if he is unable to get to where I expect him to be. Clay and I told Lea that we thought with a good set of plans, we could hopefully get a good contractor to work with. The group was concerned by the possibility of many RFI's and change orders. That is what we discussed. In summary, we will meet at Town Hall this coming Monday at 9:30 am. Would you think about estimates for a plain bridge approach and maybe one with some architectural focus? Can it be done for 4.5 million? How long would it take to prepare new plans and get to bid for this? Thank you, Nancy ----- Original Message ----- From: Daniel Chapman To: Nancy Cline Cc: Jerry Holder Sent: Fri Jan 22 14:13:07 2010 Subject: RE: Bridge Nancy: Jerry left you a voice message. He is booked solid Monday morning. He is available at 2:00 pm. I believe his attendance is not required if the meeting must be at 9:30 am. Thanks, Dan -----Original Message----- From: Nancy Cline [mailto:ncline@addisontx.gov] Sent: Friday, January 22, 2010 2:11 PM To: Daniel Chapman Subject: Re: Bridge Dan, I appreciate your response. Do you know if Jerry can make it? Nancy ----- Original Message ----- From: Daniel Chapman To: Nancy Cline Sent: Fri Jan 22 14:01:58 2010 Subject: Re: Bridge Nancy - I am available. Dan Daniel J. Chapman, P.E. HNTB Corporation 5910 W. Plano Parkway, Ste. 200 Plano, TX 75093 (972) 632-9556 (Mobile) (972) 628-3041 (Office) www.hntb.com ----- Original Message ----- From: Nancy Cline To: Daniel Chapman Sent: Fri Jan 22 13:46:49 2010 Subject: Fw: Bridge Dan, Please read below. Nancy ----- Original Message ----- From: Nancy Cline To: 'jholder@hntb.com' Sent: Fri Jan 22 11:57:08 2010 Subject: Bridge Jerry, Ron would like to discuss condition of bridge plans with HNTB this coming Monday morning at 9:30 am. Clay is worried about plans still. Does this time possibly work for you and Dan? Thank you, Nancy ****************************************************************************************************************** This e-mail and any files or attachments transmitted with it contains Information that is confidential and privileged. This document may contain Protected Health Information (PHI) or other information that is intended only for the use of the individual(s) and entity(ies) to whom it is addressed. If you are the intended recipient, further disclosures are prohibited without proper authorization. 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If you are NOT the intended recipient or the person responsible for delivering the e-mail to the intended recipient, be advised that you have received this e-mail in error and that any use, dissemination, forwarding, printing or copying this e-mail is strictly prohibited. ****************************************************************************************************************** This e-mail and any files or attachments transmitted with it contains Information that is confidential and privileged. This document may contain Protected Health Information (PHI) or other information that is intended only for the use of the individual(s) and entity(ies) to whom it is addressed. If you are the intended recipient, further disclosures are prohibited without proper authorization. If you are not the intended recipient, any disclosure, copying, printing, or use of this information is strictly prohibited and possibly a violation of federal or state law and regulations. If you have received this information in error, please delete it and notify Hamid Khaleghipour at 972-450-2868 immediately. Thank you. ******************************************************************************************************************* This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and are intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you are NOT the intended recipient or the person responsible for delivering the e-mail to the intended recipient, be advised that you have received this e-mail in error and that any use, dissemination, forwarding, printing or copying this e-mail is strictly prohibited.